the MRH Forum

Future of hobby publishing? General discussion
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MRH Founder 20,243 posts joef MRH Founder 20,243 posts
joef
On another thread, some discussion ensued about the future of hobby publishing -- specifically, the future direction of Firecrown, White River, and MRH Media. And perhaps the NMRA Magazine as well.
 
Let's move that discussion over here. In order to avoid skewing the discussion, I will avoid commenting on the other publishers. I will only speak about MRH as a direct answer to questions.

Joe Fugate​    
Publisher, Model Railroad Hobbyist magazine

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Reply 5
Michael Tondee MRH Author 6,762 posts
Michael Tondee
I want everyone to succeed, I sincerely mean that, but I just have no use for any print publication anymore in any of my hobbies.
I might, on a very rare occasion, buy a copy of MR, RMC or NG&SLG at the news stand if something really jumps out at me but I much prefer to consume all my content digitally these days.

Michael, A.R.S. W4HIJ

Model Rail and "mad scientist" for over 50 years.

Member of "The Amigos", Co-Inventor of the A.O.S.T.

I call what I do "An artistic impression of reality" and the Island is "lost" somewhere in the Pacific Northwest, see it here...

The Blackwater Island Logging & Mining Co.
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David Emery deemery2 Prolific poster 4,738 posts
David Emery deemery2
Publications need 3 groups to succeed:  Readers, advertisers, and authors.  I think the successful publication (on-line or paper) marries authors with readers, and the advertisers follow.   The challenge for the editor is getting enough appealing author content to keep the reader interest level up.  Part of that is having a clear sense of purpose/role, so authors know what the editor will buy, and readers know what they're likely to get in each issue.  
 
And content has to balance between broad appeal for beginner audience, and deep appeal for established modelers.   Now maybe every 2-3 months there'll be an article in one of the magazines that is of direct interest to me.  But I hope every month there's an article of interest, where I'd learn something even if it's not directly applicable to my modeling niche.  
 
The one thing I can't judge is how well each magazine pays.  I do know that Bernie Kempinski claimed his model railroading books and articles helped pay for his Porsche, but I don't know -how much- that contribution was. 😂
 
dave
Modeling 1890s northeast US
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porthos Frequent poster 595 posts
porthos
I admit to having developed an aversion to print magazines at this point so MRH and RE fall right into my wheel house. Yet I still enjoy the process of flipping pages and making a careful study of every page and that provides a level of satisfaction that I don't get with their digital cousins so I have reached a compromise...sort of.
 
As an example I will continue to buy the annuals from White River, those fulfill my page turning needs. However, I won't touch their digital subscriptions. While I am willing to pay for digital subscriptions I want to be able to download those subscriptions into my chosen device and read it with whatever reader, primarily Kindle, I have installed. White River requires me to log in to their website and read material I have paid for through their own application. They are in control of that material and I'm basically just allowed to read it there. If their site goes down or they shut down then any digital material that I have purchased from them goes away. I just don't find that acceptable, so my collection of Gazettes continues to grow.
 
I understand the arguments about maintaining copyrights and the potential loss of revenue if those digital editions are passed on to some one else. Yet the same it happens with print magazines as well. Some of us just pass them on when we are done. The flip side being that I could potentially pass on a digital copy to everyone in my email lists as opposed to a single copy of a print magazine. I have lost access to digital books that I purchased from AK Interactive that I could only access through their website, I won't put myself in that position anymore.
Kris
It's not denial. I'm very selective about the reality I accept. -- Calvin (Calvin & Hobbes)
Artificial Intelligence is no match for natural stupidity
Man will occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of the time he just picks himself up and stumbles on. -- Winston Churchill
Tardis Express: When it absolutely, positively, has to be there yesterday.
Reply 1
Ancientmariner Prolific poster 2,581 posts
Ancientmariner
I received the current issue of MR this morning. I haven't yet read it in detail, but a quick look seems to be more . . . dense? Information rich? More 'there' there? I'm not sure how to describe it. Better. Only 74 pages, but it seems encouraging.  I don't see it as competition to MRH at all. MRH has become like a part of my family. MR is a different sort of animal altogether. I hope they both thrive for my lifetime and beyond.
 
There was a time before the Planning issues and Classic Trains were introduced. No one threatened to cancel subscriptions because of the lack. I'm sorry that business conditions made their demise necessary, but I'm not going to cut off my remaining fingers just because one or two had to be amputated. As long as I receive reasonable value for money spent, I'll stick around.
R/ Tony Anderson
 
Half of what I know is wrong. Bear with me while I figure out which half.
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joef MRH Founder 20,243 posts
joef
I don't see it [MR] as competition to MRH at all. MRH has become like a part of my family. MR is a different sort of animal altogether.
I totally agree. Same with White River and RMC. Each is a different animal, and together we create a marvelous diversity of content on the hobby.
 
I will retire back into my corner now ...

Joe Fugate​    
Publisher, Model Railroad Hobbyist magazine

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Reply 1
GNNPNUT Frequent poster 702 posts
GNNPNUT
I recently re-subscribed to "Model Railroader". The single largest reason is that MRR allows for reading through the Libby library service.  Yes, my local library has to pay for Libby access, and specifically has to have a MRR subscription, but the incremental cost to me is ZERO.  Also, if you check out the magazine quality of late, I think it is outstanding.  They are doing more actualy construction articles, and they just did a very nice article on 3D modeling on various production platforms (laser, FDM printing, resin printing etc.).  
 
I still find accessing Trains.com to be a frustrating experience, but was able to get on after three attempts.  The cost I paid for an annual subscription was less that a year of "Running Extra", which I also subscribe to.  
 
RMC no longer gets my business as I cannot download a PDF file any longer since they brought their electronic pub hosting in-house.  Both MRR and RE / MRH allow me to download a PDF.  
 
Regards,
Jerry

GNNPNUT's blog
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Glenn Butcher ggbutcher Prolific poster 1,384 posts
Glenn Butcher ggbutcher
Well, I'm not (yet) a MRH subscriber, so maybe my view isn't pertinent... However.
 
Last thing I ever subscribed to was Linux Weekly News, LWN for short, to the tune of about $5US per month. It is in the format of a blog with comments, very pertinent when I was teaching, but my attention span gradually dwindled to where I just decided not to renew. Still check it daily for headline tidbits, sometimes wish I'd just had kept paying, but not enough to do something about it.
 
I subscribed to Model Railroader for a long time. Finally stopped that when I realized they had abandoned all hint of real scratchbuilding; now, my collection is a file box of articles of interest to me, a large boon in much needed storage space. Most recent dealing was with the K-27 drawing from a IIRC 1992 edition; fellow wanted a copy, but I couldn't figure out easily how to make a clean .pdf, and decided it wasn't worth the effort for the exposure to claims of copyright infringement.
 
The only paper periodical I still get is the monthly Friends of the Cumbres and Toltec Dispatch. Chris James does a great job of assembling a publication with both current events and history articles. Due to my frequent attendance at work sessions, I'm usually in one or more pictures in each edition, I use these to show my wife I'm not just hanging out in the bars. They're only about 15-20 pages each, so storage isn't an issue, yet.
 
While doing research for my doctorate, ran across a self-published periodical about software maintenance. A lot of good information in that 5 or so years of existence; when I finished my degree I worked to get the publisher's collection moved to a library. I hope they kept it.
 
There's a lot of useful information that collects over time in forums like this; I was recently compelled to leave the Narrow Gauge Dead Goat Saloon running for a time to afford a history researcher to do his thing; we get maybe 2-3 posts a month, and there are other more-active forums in the genre, so $40US/month for webserver is just not worth it. Narrow Gauge Discussion Forum is the go-to for that subject; all the authorities the world over post there, and it goes back decades, covering discussions including folk long-passed.
 
I guess what I'm getting at is that how we communicate has changed. I do miss reading a morning paper, but I get the news I need quite easily over the internets. Forums like MRH collect a lot of useful information, sometimes more than once, but that's a side-effect of the medium. Articles IMHO are still quite useful; evolution in to blog posts is not a bad thing. What's critical to whatever we move to is the ability to retain the corpus for future access. That was fragile enough with periodical media, probably a different sort of fragile with digital media.
Reply 1
Backshophoss101 Regular poster 151 posts
Backshophoss101
At present. The September issue of "Trains"is digital only on a app that's not Android friendly
called "zinio" and no .pdf option
I prefer print or a .pdf file that doesn't need another app to use
"Trains . com" has always a bit wonky even as a subscriber  
Firecrown is still  not handling this situation at all
Reply 0
Joseph Toth Jr. Prolific poster 2,553 posts
Joseph Toth Jr.
Good idea Mr. Fugate
 
I hope the following falls within the subject of your new thread. If not, delete! Simple as that!
 
Over on the "How MRH got it's name" thread, professional railroader, and large scale modeler, Craig Townsend (BN 8th Sub Blog) mentioned that he believes Firecrown is leaning towards competing with the leading trade magazine devoted to the railroad industy, Railway Age. He also invites everyone to visit their website and sample the magazine.  
 
Railway Age http://www.railwayage.com) is published by Simmons-Boardman Publishing Corp. They also publish two other trade magazines, International Railway Journal http://www.railjournal.com) , and Railway Track & Structures http://www.rtands.com). In addition, S-B http://www.simmonsboardman.com) also publishes books on railroading, not only trade publications.  
 
As a rule, one can read the online issue of Railway Age for free several days after it has been announced on it's website. This is not always the case and you may be required to take out a paid subscription. A paid subscription is required to read International Railway Journal! On the other hand, I read Railway Track & Structures every month without taking out a subscription. Thus far anyway.  All news items relating to the railroad industry can be read online and you can even sign up to receive free e-mails which cover breaking news from all three magazines as well.
 
Note: I found the August issue of RT&S to be very interesting. The following articals are included in this month's issue:
 
1) Editor's Notebook by David C. Lestor, RT&S Editor in Chief: "What Big Boy's Trip Did for the Industry and for America".
 
2) From the Dome: "Remembering Ed King, Writer, Railroader" by Kevin Keefe, Retired VP-Editorial, Kalmbach Publishing Co.  
          Also noted: The Ed King profile appears in RT&S courtesy of Bill Stevens, Editor of Trains Magazine, Firecrown Publishing Co.  
 
For a fact, this is quite interesting! Can this be posibly be a sign of the things to come?  Perhaps?  Whatever, enjoy reading the magazines.  
 
jtj
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joef MRH Founder 20,243 posts
joef
One long term strategy we have is publishing "best of" topic-centric paperback reprints of MRH and RE articles. We have one already, Vol 1 on Trackwork. Plan is to do a volume 2 on servo turnout control, and many other volumes on a whole host of topics.
 
I can tell you the trackwork volume 1 is pretty cool. When you collect the best of trackwork articles all under one cover, it's a very useful book - and if you want paper, then hey there you go.
 
Back again into my corner ...

Joe Fugate​    
Publisher, Model Railroad Hobbyist magazine

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Read my blog
Reply 1
Lirrlirr Frequent poster 598 posts
Lirrlirr
I received the current issue of MR this morning. I haven't yet read it in detail, but a quick look seems to be more . . . dense? Information rich? More 'there' there? I'm not sure how to describe it. Better. Only 74 pages, but it seems encouraging.  I don't see it as competition to MRH at all. MRH has become like a part of my family. MR is a different sort of animal altogether. I hope they both thrive for my lifetime and beyond.
 
There was a time before the Planning issues and Classic Trains were introduced. No one threatened to cancel subscriptions because of the lack. I'm sorry that business conditions made their demise necessary, but I'm not going to cut off my remaining fingers just because one or two had to be amputated. As long as I receive reasonable value for money spent, I'll stick around.
I remember when the typical issue of MR was about 140 pages.....
Reply 1
Glenn Butcher ggbutcher Prolific poster 1,384 posts
Glenn Butcher ggbutcher
One long term strategy we have is publishing "best of" topic-centric paperback reprints of MRH and RE articles. We have one already, Vol 1 on Trackwork. Plan is to do a volume 2 on servo turnout control, and many other volumes on a whole host of topics.
 
I can tell you the trackwork volume 1 is pretty cool. When you collect the best of trackwork articles all under one cover, it's a very useful book - and if you want paper, then hey there you go.
 
Back again into my corner ...
Y'know, I'd forgotten about the how-to books. I kept all the Kalmbach books I've bought over the years, represent the best ratio of information-to-storage space. And, I think periodic revisions are good, capture and incorporate new stuff and keep the book relevant.
Reply 0
David Emery deemery2 Prolific poster 4,738 posts
David Emery deemery2
At present. The September issue of "Trains"is digital only on a app that's not Android friendly
called "zinio" and no .pdf option
I prefer print or a .pdf file that doesn't need another app to use
"Trains . com" has always a bit wonky even as a subscriber  
Firecrown is still  not handling this situation at all
That shows Firecrown didn't learn from Kalmbach's mistakes in digital publishing.  Proprietary apps are always going to have long-term problems.  
 
dave
Modeling 1890s northeast US
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Joseph Toth Jr. Prolific poster 2,553 posts
Joseph Toth Jr.
As a member in good standing of the "Old Head" club (I passed Milepost 80 on July the Fourth) I well remember when Model Railorader was almost as thick as the Yellow Pages. LOL Don't forget, it wasn't only the artical content, but the mass number of ads in every issue that made MR as thick as it was in those by gone days.  
 
What I wouldn't give to walk into the rear entrance of Hall's Hobby House in Dallas again and thumb through all the latest magazines on the rack across from the long shelf of books and pour a cup of good fresh brewed coffee from the pot next to the cold drink machine. A donation to the coffee kitty wasn't required but I always dropped 50 cents into the tin can just the same. In all my years I never encountered a cat that was as hungry as that one was! Good Grief 😁
 
jtj
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Craig Hatter PC modeler Regular poster 135 posts
Craig Hatter PC modeler
I was recently in a Books A Million killing time before a medical appointment. I briefly looked at the current issues of MR and RMC. Nothing there for me and MR is a shadow of itself. RMC remains the better choice. MR was $8.99 a copy and RMC was $9.99. I know a yearly subscription cuts that cost in half but I'm still paying less for MRH with Running Extra with substantially more articles and topics.  
I still live in the past and lament the loss of Mainline Modeler, Rail Model Journal, and Model Railroading.
Because I model the Penn Central I am a member of the NYC, PRR, and PC Historical Societies . Targeted data for members /modelers for sure. I also have subscribed to Diesel Era since they began publishing as well as TRP.
 
Craig Hatter
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jumijo Regular poster 121 posts
jumijo
I’m not gonna pay $12 for a single issue of a print magazine. It’s as simple as that. So that means I need to go online to find the best and most relevant hobby information. Forums provide good technical advice as well as motivational material. They also serve up industry news in real-time. Online publications are where I look for the traditional layout and how-to articles. Print magazines used to be the only source for all these things, but that is no longer the case. A savvy modeler today will search for and find the online sources that suit their interests.
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macmoo Regular poster 161 posts
macmoo
I remember when the typical issue of MR was about 140 pages.....
I think a lot of those pages were probably advertising...
 
Anyhow, I mentioned it on the other thread ... I think the latest issue is quite good  and hopefully a sign that MR is trying to turn the ship around. Sometimes it takes a lot longer than you hope it will.
 
Nine dollars for a magazine is still pretty inexpensive. If it gives me a couples of hours of entertainment it's a pretty good deal. In a few months time I'll recycle it. The MRP article was very good.
 
Cheers
John
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Jeff Brauer Regular poster 103 posts
Jeff Brauer
I'm an old guy, but even I am getting more comfortable with e-magazines, so I figure the monthly periodical will continue to die off, at least for low circulation magazines, like MR magazines. What was the old joke? Magazines will stick around as long as you can't fit a computer in the toilet area? lol.
 
I remember ditching RMC when they did an article on scratch building an outhouse, although I could get behind some flickering circuits in them to simulate the interior "action".😁 I didn't think I would ever scratch build anything, and all these years later, I was right, although I love kit bashing with some added styrene parts. So, there wasn't much of it I read, but I subscribe again, mostly to reward them for a job well done in their current magazine.
 
And frankly, I probably won't ever give up on the three mags listed in this thread. Just like LHS (and NMRA), it you want them around, you need to support them if you can afford it.
 
Somewhat OT, but I have been thinking about suggesting this for a short while now.....Would an MR version of "Trains Hot Spots" articles be of interest? I envision picking an area, like Chicago, DFW, etc. and highlighting the MR scene in those cities, listing railfan sites, LHS, best clubs, train shows, and even private layouts? Just a thought, since after a while, Model Railroader can only do so many stories on ballasting track
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Michael Tondee MRH Author 6,762 posts
Michael Tondee
Happy to report that I was finally able to get monthly access to trains.com.
I opted for the monthly access option which runs 7.99 and gives me access to everything.
I'll give it 2 or 3 months and see how much I use it and then maybe I'll re up for a year, maybe not.
Again though, I have no desire to receive MR in my mailbox anymore, or any other periodical for that matter.
They just end up stashed somewhere in boxes , taking up space, after being read.
I think the majority of the world is stating to feel the way I do about all print media.

Michael, A.R.S. W4HIJ

Model Rail and "mad scientist" for over 50 years.

Member of "The Amigos", Co-Inventor of the A.O.S.T.

I call what I do "An artistic impression of reality" and the Island is "lost" somewhere in the Pacific Northwest, see it here...

The Blackwater Island Logging & Mining Co.
Reply 0
PM Railfan Prolific poster 1,148 posts
PM Railfan
I think one thing to remember about Model Railroader being 140 pages, is yes it was alot of advertising. You take all that stuff out and the real meat and potatoes was only about 30 pages of that 140.
 
Also, and prolly more importantly to remember about this is, back then when MR was 140 pages, that was our internet. That was our way to communicate. I dont think even todays publishers would dispute - at one time - Kalmbach and MR were pretty much the flagship for the hobby. And if you didnt have MR, you were seeking a copy of Walthers Catalog. The only two known sources you could count on 100%.
 
It does lend creedence to the cliche - "mye, how the mighty have fallen.".
 
 
In the present way of thinking, we see the fruits of 'corporate' versus 'ma & pa'. New verses old. And it isnt the business model per-se. Both new and old are using the latest technologys like Ai and the internet. A presence here and there on the social disease platforms like disgracebook and YT.
 
Seems to me at the end of the day it comes down to the personal touch. The ones pulling the strings are actually...... "Modellers", not titled entitys like "CEO, COO, or what ever you can make with 3 letters starting with C".
 
In other words - 'Hobbyist'. Hmmmm, where have i heard that before???
 
 
-PMR
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